Catholics Worship Mary! The Hail Mary Proves it.



Maria; Just check the title of one of “the OFFICIAL prayers of the Church” – HAIL Mary. It made me smile. Will you say that “hailing” is NOT the same as “worshipping”?

BFHU: The word hail simply means greetings. Hailing is absolutely not the same as worshiping. In the USA we play the song Hail to the Chief for the Pres. of the US. Do you think Americans therefore worship the President?
Maria: So assuming that you really are not worshiping Mary, let’s go to “Do we need to ask Mary or the saints to pray for us?”

BFHU:
No. It is NOT mandatory.

Maria:
The Bible says that it is only Jesus who can bridge the gap between us and God. (1 Timothy 2:5) So, it is clear then that Mary nor any other saints is ‘good’ enough to intercede between us and God. Only God is good enough for that. (Matthew 19:17; Mark 10:18)

BFHU:

James 5:16 pray for one another so that you may be healed The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much.

So you reject this Scripture along with Martin Luther? Intercessory prayer IS a form of mediation.

Maria: It is true that the prayer of an righteous person is powerful.
Now the question is “What makes a person righteous?

BFHU: Mary was righteous. Even more so than Abraham.

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31 Responses

  1. The church is a place to worship God and Jesus who was God in the flesh and died for us as a penalty for our sins. Most Catholic church names begin with “Our Lady”. Outside and inside Catholic churches I see statues of Mary. I see a lot of evidence the Catholic church worships Mary. As for intercessory prayer, I do believe in it. I don’t believe in prayer to Mary or the Saints. Ecclesiastes 9:5 says “For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten. 6 Their love, their hate and their jealousy have long since vanished; never again will they have a part in anything that happens under the sun.” Requesting intercessory prayer from a dead person has no effect other than to insult God. When the disciples asked Jesus to teach them to pray Luke 11:2 says “So He said to them, “When you pray, say: Our Father in heaven”. Jesus didn’t teach them to pray to a dead person but directly to the Father. James 5:13 says “Is anyone among you suffering? Let him pray. Is anyone cheerful? Let him sing psalms. 14 Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord. 15 And the prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. 16 Confess your trespasses F23 to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The effective, fervent prayer of a righteous man avails much. ” Always in scripture intercessory prayer is requested of the living. There is no example in scripture of those alive in Christ requesting intercessory prayer from the dead. Not to mention we don’t need Mary or the saints to be intercessors for us. We have an advocate in heaven for us. His name is Jesus. 1 John 2:1-2 “1 My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; 2 and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.” God gave us free will. We can believe whatever we want. If what we believe doesn’t align with scripture then we believe a lie. The traditions and writings of man are irrelevant when it comes to our faith in God. You can’t isolate one or two lines from a passage of scripture and build a doctrine on it.

  2. Harvey: Outside and inside Catholic churches I see statues of Mary. I see a lot of evidence the Catholic church worships Mary.

    BFHU: If i were to come to your home would it be fair of me to decide and teach others that you worship your parents, brothers and sisters, wife and children (if you have them) just because I see pictures of them in your home?

    Harvey:As for intercessory prayer, I do believe in it. I don’t believe in prayer to Mary or the Saints. Ecclesiastes 9:5 says “For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten. 6 Their love, their hate and their jealousy have long since vanished; never again will they have a part in anything that happens under the sun.”

    BFHU: This is the OT view. There are also many passages that seem to deny the resurrection to life after death of the body, but others contradict those verses. This was the source of the disagreement between the Sadducees (no resurrection) and Pharisees (believed in resurrection) during the time of Jesus. He cleared it up negating this literal sort of understanding of some of the verses. Also a lot of people rose from the dead after Jesus rose from the dead.

    Harvey: Requesting intercessory prayer from a dead person has no effect other than to insult God.

    BFHU:How do you KNOW it has not effect? Do you think the intercession of the Saints would have survived for 2000 years if it really had no effect? Catholics are not that holy. We like results just like everyone else. On the contrary the intercession of Saints “has great power in its effect.” Why would that insult God. He is the one who delights in our love and concern for one another.

    Harvey: Always in scripture intercessory prayer is requested of the living.

    BFHU: True but nothing in scripture forbids it.

    Harvey: Not to mention we don’t need Mary or the saints to be intercessors for us. We have an advocate in heaven for us.

    BFHU:If the advocacy of Jesus is the only one we should avail ourselves of then why would we be exhorted to “pray for one another”?

    Harvey: God gave us free will. We can believe whatever we want. If what we believe doesn’t align with scripture then we believe a lie.

    BFHU: We believe in NOTHING that contradicts SCRIPTURE. Our beliefs only contradict Protestant INTERPRETATION of Scripture. Besides, there is nothing in Scripture that supports your statement “If what we believe doesn’t align with scripture then we believe a lie. ” This is based on nothing but opinion.

    Harvey: The traditions and writings of man are irrelevant when it comes to our faith in God. You can’t isolate one or two lines from a passage of scripture and build a doctrine on it.

    BFHU: We do not do this. Our doctrine was passed down to up from the teachings of Jesus to His apostles. The New Testament derived from some of these teachings. It is Protestants who derive their doctrine out of scripture. Our doctrine preceded the canonization of the Scripture.

  3. 1 Tim 2:5 states: “For there is one God. There is also one mediator between God and the human race, Christ Jesus…” Jesus is the “one”–the Greek word used is “heis,” meaning “primary and foundational.” Notice that the original text used “heis” instead of “monos.” Both words translate into the word “one” in English, but in Greek, it is the word “monos” that means “only and exclusive.” If Jesus was the only mediator between us and God, would Timothy not have used the word “monos” instead of “heis”? It seems that Timothy was saying that although there are other mediators, their prayers and supplications would do nothing without Jesus’ help.

    Catholics ask for Mary’s and the saints’ prayers–not as a kind of worship of them, but rather, in honor of them. The kind of honor we give Mary and the saints is an act of showing respect; it is an act of recognizing the great thing God has done in their lives. This honor does not take away from the praise we need to give God. On the contrary, it gives more attention to God by praising his perfect creation! Look at the many Psalms that praise God for all his natural creation… think of how much more praise we should give Him for his supernatural creation! He took weak, sinful human beings and elevated them with His divine grace and had them enter into His Kingdom. We can only hope that we can be made perfect enough to be with Him eternally; why should we not recognize the countless souls that God has already perfected?

    When we die, we don’t disconnect from Jesus; rather, souls in heaven–the saints–are in a perfect and eternal union with Him. Just because people die does not mean they are no longer in union with us. For Jesus said that he is “not the God of the dead but of the living, for to him all are alive” (Lk 20:38). They are not disconnected from our lives because of a physical death; if they are alive in Jesus, they are connected to the lives of all believers. The saints are eternally loving God and unceasingly wanting His will to be done. Their prayers for our salvation never end.

    Of all the saints, Mary is the greatest. Not only did God elevate her to perfection, but He created her as “the one who has been and continues to be be graced” (“kecharitomine” ref. Lk 1:28). On top of this, she is the Queen Mother–the mother of the King–who holds a place of honor and a place of authority. Just as Solomon would not deny the requests of the people petitioned to the Queen Mother, Bathsheba, so too will Jesus not deny the requests of the people petitioned to his Queen Mother, Mary (ref. 1 Kings 12:24). She is the advocate for her Son’s Kingdom, and it is her role to take our petitions to the King.

  4. Does the Bible say?
    1) Pray to Mary.
    2) Pray to Saints (Dead).

    **Jesus Christ is the only mediator between God and men. 1Timothy2:5

    **Jesus said “I am The Way, The Truth and The Life.” John 14:6

    **Jesus said “No one comes to the Father except through Me”. John 14:6

    * Has anyone gone to Heaven except Jesus Christ?
    **“No man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.” John 3:13 – Jesus Christ himself.

    *Jesus said “So be on your guard; I have told you everything ahead of time”. Mark 13:23

    *God Said “My people are destroyed from lack of knowledge”. Hosea 4:6

    *“Believe in Lord Jesus Christ and be Saved – you and your household”. Acts 16:31

    *Jesus Said “My sheep hear my voice, I know them, They follow me, I give then eternal life and no one can snatch them from My hand”. John 10:27

    In Luke 11:27 as Jesus was saying these things, a woman in the crowd called out, “Blessed is the mother who gave you birth and nursed you.”, a woman said to Jesus, but Jesus answered, “Blessed rather are those who hear the word of God and obey it”. (Luke 11:27-28).

    God is Love,
    He cares for his Children,
    John 10:16 Jesus said ” I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, …

    Apple is not an Apple because it grows on Apple tree,
    Apple is an Apple because, Apple tree produces Apple.

    We are not sinners because we sin,
    We are sinners because we are born sinner.

    But now Washed, Purified and Sanctified with the Precious Blood of Jesus Christ.
    Bibls says, A complete new creation Born Again Christians.

    Then God said … “Yes, I know you did this with clear conscience, and so I have kept you from sinning against Me.” … Gen.20:6

    … Since the first day that you set your mind to gain understanding and to humble your self before your God, your words were heard. Daniel 10:12.

    God Bless you,
    Bro. Alex Dhanvate.
    Sydney

  5. Dear Alex,
    Where does the Bible say it is forbidden to pray to Mary and the Saints?

    Also Where does the Bible say all religious truth is to be found ONLY in Scripture?

    I agree completely with all the verses you posted.

    • Brother, read your catechism and then read your bible. I can plainly see that the catechism of the Roman Catholic Church has contradicted the word of God, not in all parts, but in specific key areas of doctrine. (For instance the 10 commandments have been altered…they differ from the bible in that the catechism has removed the “Thou shall not worhsip Idols” commandment. Why?

      BFHU:

      BFHU: We followed the Jews for combining Ex 20: 3-6 into just one commandment.

      Please see : The Catholic Church Changed the Ten Commandments?

      Why does the catechism explicitly say that the pope as supreme, universal control over the whole church that he can perform un-hindered?

      I do not know what you are quoting. I only found the following entry nothing about “unhindered” The Protestant idea of the power of the pope is more myth than anything else. His authority derives only from the authority of Christ to physically rule the Church. Otherwise we have what the Jews had in the time of the Judges when every man did what was right in his own eyes. This is basically all Protestants are able to do b/c they lack a leader with any final authority.CCC 937

      The Pope enjoys, by divine institution, “supreme, full, immediate, and universal power in the care of souls” (CD 2).

      Please note the power is in the “care of souls

      Only Jesus Christ has this supreme control over the whole church.

      BFHU: Of course, Jesus is the Spiritual Head of His Church and the pope is the visible head of the His Church.

      Look at the start of revelations and tell me who is going to judge the churches.

      BFHU: Jesus

      will the pope have supreme control over this.

      BFHU: No,

      Look up the word “supreme” and tell me what it means. Can you honestly say that the pope has supreme control over the whole church.

      BFHU: Remember the CCC says “in the care of souls.”

      (Remember that it says universal control as well in the catechism…this is going beyond the bounds of the earth!)

      BFHU: In this context universal doesn’t pertaining to the whole universe but pertaining to all souls.

      u⋅ni⋅ver⋅sal
      –adjective
      1. of, pertaining to, or characteristic of all or the whole: universal experience.
      2. applicable everywhere or in all cases; general: a universal cure.
      3. affecting, concerning, or involving all: universal military service.
      4. used or understood by all: a universal language.
      5. present everywhere: the universal calm of southern seas.
      6. versed in or embracing many or all skills, branches of learning, etc.: Leonardo da Vinci was a universal genius.
      7. of or pertaining to the universe, all nature, or all existing things: universal cause.
      8. characterizing all or most members of a class; generic.
      9. Logic. (of a proposition) asserted of every member of a class.
      10. Linguistics. found in all languages or belonging to the human language faculty.

      The catechism speeks for on what the Roman Catholic Church believes. I have only given 2 examples.

      BFHU: Yes, but you are misunderstanding because of traditional Protestant teaching and interpretation. You still have not proven that anything the Catholic Church believes contradicts Scripture. It doesn’t. We have legitimate alternative interpretation of scripture PLUS the belief and practice Historical Christianity for 2000 years.

      Now as for mary worship. The RC catechism explicitly states that Mary id a Mediatrix and a Redemptrix because she also Mediates for us and Redeems us into heaven. This IS apostacy?

      BFHU: No on all counts. We do NOT worship Mary. She is not the fourth person of the Holy Trinity. The catechism does NOT state that Mary is our Redemptrix or Redeemer or redeems us into Heaven. Someone has been lying to you or else believes lies they were taught.

      Mary is called a Mediatrix only for her role as the Mother of God and clothing Christ with her flesh, in the incarnation. So, only in this limited sense is she a mediatrix of salvation. Not in the heretical way Protestants try to malign the Catholic Church.

      The same is true of her title CO-redemptrix. She is NOT called a Redemptrix. And again she is a Co-redemptrix only in the sense that she obeys Christ, gave him human flesh, and cooperates by her intercessory prayers with Christ for the salvation of every man.

      Only Jesus Christ is redeems us with HIS blood shed at the cross.

      BFHU: I agree completely

      The catechism of the Roman Catholic Church contradicts the word of God.

      BFHU: Where? Show us a clear example that is not interpreted differently, cannot possibly be interpreted differently. Unless you claim infallibility in interpretation.

      The problem though is that you believe that the laws of the church are above scripture because you have been taught that the RC church is the only real church on earth ordained by God and Jesus through Peter but Peter was not a Pope of the Roman Church.

      BFHU: Nothing the Church teaches contradict one single verse of scripture.

      Only Paul visited rome to spread the word not Peter. Where is the evidence that the Popes are inheritors of the apostolic faith?

      BFHU: In scripture. see my posts in the Pope category.

      The bible clearly teaches that all Christians are made priests by the blood of Jesus Christ.

      BFHU: Yes, the Catholic Church teaches this as well. We are all part of the universal priesthood of Christ. But our priests and bishops and popes are ministerial. Please see my post on this issue under the categoary: Priests.

      There is no such thing as the Pope, the priests and the laity. As shepherds you should be chief servants and you should not teach what is not in the bible so why
      do?

      BFHU: That is your opinion. But you have no biblical proof that we “should not teach what is not in the Bible.”

      • Dear Colin:

        I am not being mean or flippant but you have been taught many lies, distortions, and half truths about the Catholic Church just like I was. When I actually started looking into what the Catholic Church actually teaches I was appalled that I had never tried to find out myself much earlier. I just trusted all the pastors and books I learned from.

        So, I have compiled links to some of my posts on these few topics. Under Categories in the right sidebar, you will find many other topics of interest. The earlier posts are sometimes better that conversations I have had with individuals on topics or questions that are less general.

        Why Did the Catholic Church Drop the Commandment about Idols?

        One Mediator


        Why Do Catholics Pray to Mary?

        Priesthood of All Believers

        Priesthood in Scripture

        Popes and Bishops in the Early Church

        Why Can’t Catholic Priests Get Married?

        Call No Man Father

        Scripture versus the Catholic Church: Call No Man Father

        Why celibacy?

      • I don’t know how you can miss CCC 882

        “the Roman Pontiff, by reason of his office as Vicar of Christ, and as pastor of the entire Church has full, supreme and universal power over the whole Church, a power which he can always exercise unhindered.”

        and ccc 937 “The Pope enjoys, by divine institution, supreme, full, immediate and universal power in the care of souls.”

        If you really believe the above then brother you read something in the bible that I don’t…and I can’t accept how anyone can defend changing the 10 commandments by saying that because someone else has done it then how can we be wrong?

        Come on…The Lord gave us the power of descernment so use it!

        I am not getting into a tit for tat slanging match over the word of God. If you choose to believe some hyped up catechism put together by men over the word of God then that is a problem that you have to sort out for yourself.

        I for one choose to believe the bible. I am baptist, you are roman catholic…we could go on for ages but I do hope that people can read the Roman Catholic Catechism and come to their own conclusions…Feel free to say what you like about the above 882 paragraph but I won’t accept any political rigling by anyone who wants to deny the glory of our King Jesus Christ.

  6. To the ignorant of the Bible (yes, all you “Bible-only” folks), the New Testament was written by Catholic men. The Bible table of contents was authored by the Catholic Church. Not everything was written in the Bible, the Scriptures plainly tell you that. God inspired Catholic men to write the New Testament, and then inspired the Catholic Church to assemble the Bible. This is the only reason you have a Bible (which you misinterpret). God’s Church relies on Oral and Written Tradition and the Magisterium. The Catholic Church was built and is protected by Christ from error in faith an morals. Yet, you believe you know better. This would qualify for what you’ve asked. I don’t take you for an idiot, otherwise I would not bother telling you these beautiful truths. Apparently, you treat yourself worse than I do, by believing yourself above Jesus.

    If you don’t think Mary is your mother, then are you not a Disciple that Jesus loves?

    Mary is indeed Queen of Heaven. If you don’t believe the Queen Mother sits at the right hand of the King, then for starters please read the OT in regard to Solomon. The Davidic Kingdom was a precursor to the New Covenant Kingdom with Christ as King. Christ also protected this position when asked if two could sit at His right and left hand. Jesus said he could not, because it was reserved for someone.

    Would an intelligent person think they know more than the Church built by Christ, protected by the Holy Spirit in matters of teaching faith and morals, which has His Seven Sacraments and Bishops with organic link of ordination to the Apostles, and with the Head Bishop’s office (Peter) in whom Christ built His Church upon? No, they would not. If that shoe fits, I recommend changing shoes. It’s not me who treats you poorly, but you do this to yourself. Please stop and come over to authentic Christianity the way Christ established it. If you prefer your own, based on your own interpretations of the Catholic Book, the Bible, then you will have your own religion. Please don’t then call yourself an authentic Christian. That, you are not.

  7. Colin,
    Where do you think we got the OT? From the Jews. So, since the first Christians were Jews it was only natural that they would adopt many things Jewish. There is nothing wrong with that.

    You accept the Protestant tradition of grouping the 16 verses from Ex. 20 into the Ten Commandments. That is fine but then to turn around and accuse the Catholic Church for grouping them slightly differently as being purposeful in order to legitimize the worship of idols is crass and uncharitable. You are not judging with right judgment.

    I am sorry to disappoint you but we do not worship idols, pictures, or saints. So, we did not drop the commandment in order to do so.

    Our numbering system has been used for 2000 years and we weren’t about to change it after the Protestants came along with their accusations, a short 500 years ago.

    Are you aware that your belief that all Christian truth must be found in scripture alone is a tradition of men started by Martin Luther? There is no such command in scripture. And yet you beat the Catholic Church up with demands for scripture to prove our beliefs and yet you do not have scripture for this foundational principle of Protestantism. I think the word for that is, hypocrisy.

  8. Wow. I don’t understand all this. A Catholic telling someone who believes in Christ not to call himself an authentic Christian, a man who professes to believe in Christ beating down the Catholic Church that has stood for 2000 years – guys, the true church lies within your hearts, don’t you know that? Christ lives IN YOU if you love and follow Him. We are only required to believe, and it doesn’t matter what this or that man-made doctrine says. A man can be a true worshiper of Christ even if he lives in the middle of the desert and has never heard a single homily or sermon, but has the Word of God – in fact, if God chooses to speak to a a man in the middle of the desert who has never even seen scripture, and in His speaking the man’s heart is turned, then that man is a true Christian. I know many Protestants who work hand-in-hand in their communities with Catholics. I know many Catholics who minister to Protestants in their communities. I also know that Jesus Himself said that many will say to Him that they did miracles in His Name, and He will tell them to get away from Him because He “knows them not.” So, apparently there will be some of us who THINK we are following Christ who aren’t, truly. If that’s the case, shouldn’t we just be looking to our OWN salvation, and not criticizing others in the faith? Jesus said that if you loved Him you would obey Him, and then He went on to say that His commandment was this: that you love one another. Please, if you love HIM, obey Him by loving one another and put all this doctrinal fighting to rest! I’m pretty sure, whether either of you want to believe it or not, that there will be both Protestants and Catholics in the glorious kingdom to come, where countless saints have gone before us. Make peace now.

    • bfhu,

      I am not condemning you I am just pointing out the RC catechism and how it contradicts directly the word of God. This is not me trying to get one up on you for my pride it is just that the roman catholic catechism is contradicting the bible which is given by God to us for understanding.

      I am not saying that all Catholics are lost souls. I also know catholics that attend our church. I just don’t think that any Christian should teach salvation, mediation or redemption thorugh the Rosary or Mary.

      The Gospel of Jesus Christ is salvation through Jesus Christ and his sacrifice sent by the mercy of God to all mankind. The blood of Jesus will cleanse you. The blood of Mary will do no more good for you then your own.

      I wouldn’t dream of telling any new christian to start praying to Mary. Mary was blessed because she was the mother of Jesus Christ so we are to remember her. But didn’t Jesus also say that the woman who washed his feet with her tears would also be remembered. There is no church that gives special significance to her anywhere that I know. Even the angel in revelation told John not to bow down to him because he was just a brother like him.

      We should only give reverenance in this way to The Father, The Son and the Holy Spirit. No other in scripture is given divine authority. Mary was a sinner…like the rest of us…she needed a saviour.

      Catholics believe that Mary died a virgin? In blind contradiction to what is given in scripture.

      Catholics believe that Mary was received into Heaven in body and spirit the same way Jesus was? Nowhere in scripture will you find this. (The only time this is going to happen is when Jesus Returns, which he hasn’t yet)

      Why does the roman catholic church teach this?

      That said, Morgen, you are right. This kind of talk only serves to move away from the love of Jesus Christ that we should all have. I just don’t want to even read anything on a Roman Catholic website anymore because I always get dragged into a dark river 😦

  9. Colin,
    I did not think you were condemning me or all Catholics. I think you trust your own opinions and/ or the opinions of others more than fact.

    We do not believe in the “blood of Mary”. You are listening to the wrong voices. And we do remember the woman who washed Jesus’ feet with her hair every year when we read that Gospel passage. But we don’t worship anyone but God the Father, Son & Holy Spirit.

    Mary did not sin by a singular Grace of God. Protestants limit the power of God in this matter, putting God into a box.

    The perpetual virginity of Mary does not contradict scripture, it only contradicts Protestant interpretation of scripture which is extremely inconsistent.

    If you think Mary’s assumption was unique you must not have read the OT where Enoch and Elijah were taken to heaven. The Catholic Church teaches the Assumption of Mary b/c it is an historical fact whether Protestants like it or not.

    I agree Colin you should refrain from commenting on Catholic sites until you have better educated yourself. You are very unconvincing to every Catholic b/c of your misinformed opinions.

  10. Mary is such an inspiration, because remember, too that she had free will. What a beautiful choice she made. To honor her, respect her , love her is not to be confused with what we feel for our Father God, Jesus and the holy Spirit.

    🙂

  11. is mary or saints mediating better than jesus

    • Mary is such an inspiration, because remember, too that she had free will. What a beautiful choice she made. To honor her, respect her , love her is not to be confused with what we feel for our Father God, Jesus and the holy Spirit.

      And yet this is the post right before your comment!!!??? I don’t really understand HOW Catholics can be any more clear on this issue!!!!!?????

  12. William: is mary or saints mediating better than jesus

    BFHU: NO. Do you ever ask friends or family to pray for you? Same thing.
    We have been told to “Pray for one another.”
    So, in obedience to Christ we pray for one another. Unlike Protestants we believe Christians are still alive after their bodies die, are still a part of the body of Christ, still interested in the salvation of others, and are able to pray for us.

    Protestants have faith but it is narrow and stunted due to their adherence to sola Scriptura.

  13. William:
    Yes Mary is definetely better at mediating than you or me as she was chosen from among the created to be the Mother of God. Remember Jesus is also God and he is alway just and just means we sometimes don’t deserve what we ask for. It is only through “grace” that we receive our petitions and “grace” is a free gift that we don’t deserve, but…. The blessed mother through her role as “Mother of God”(Please don’t argue about this-She is the mother of God literaly) can stand before the throne of God and place our petitions and thru her influence in God, He will grant them. To truly know this, you have to experience this in prayer and petition to the blessed mother as intercessor.
    We Catholics don’t revere her as “God” but respect and honour her as “Mother of God”. If you have a family you will understand what I mean. Jesus loved his mother and we should too…..

  14. The word hail is not for worship but for greeting, try to look for the word hail in Dictionary.com. And second, the word Mother of God is right because Jesus is God (2 Peter 1:1, Titus 2:13) and Mary was his Mother… what’s the bad thing? But we are not worshiping Mary… that’s not true…

  15. The catholic traditions have been mocking the truth since their institutions…. the papacy has a bloody history, a history of insanity, illegality, immorality. Popes are nothing more then the faces of evil…

  16. Hello Bfhu, Tell me, if people are bowing down to a statue (which they do here in Ireland) is this not tantamount to worshipping the object? There is a statue of Mary near me in Ireland (probably more like this) which has its nose almost rubbed off because people have touched it with their hands – most likely in the mistaken belief that this object made of stone imparts some sort of spirituality or healing to them.
    As for the 10 commandments (Exodus 20) – it is a well known fact that the 2nd commandment (Thou shalt not made unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in the heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyslef to them, nor serve them…. (read the entire commandment Ex. 20v4-6).. This 2nd commandment has been deleted by the Roman Catholic Church! To make up to 10, they have split the 10th commandment into 2!
    This fact was first revealed to me by someone who had once been a Roman Catholic.
    By the way, which scriptures say that “Mary was righteous. Even more so than Abraham?”
    Abraham, in fact, is the only one in the Bible that I am aware of who was referred to as “the friend of God.”
    (James 2v23) Abraham’s faith was accounted to him for righteousness. So it is with those who would
    follow him down through the annals of Biblical history.
    Mary, too, like Abraham, would have had to have come by faith. More: “The Virgin Mary – and the Bible Versus Roman Catholicism.”
    May the Lord lead you (as He did me) into all truth.

  17. If a person goes into a church does that make them a Christian? Regarding the Ten Commandments your are wrong. Please see my post that explains the difference between the Catholic numbering and the Protestant numbering. –>Why Did the Catholic Church DROP the Commandment about Idolatry?

    I see you keep demanding that I provide scriptural proof for various Catholic beliefs. But you have failed to provide scriptural proof for the Protestant dogma of Scripture Alone. Where does it say in the Bible that we must believe Scripture alone?

  18. Dear Bfhu:
    In Mark 7v13 we read that Jesus reproved the Pharisees… “Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.” When in 1545 Rome decreed that man’s tradition was to be equal in authority to the Bible, they were effectively doing the same thing as the Parisees in Jesus’ day.
    Proverbs 30v5&6: “Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.”
    The decrees of men in the Roman Catholic heirarchy add to God’s word. If we say that Mary is more righteous than Abraham – we are adding to God’s Word.
    In the final book of the Bible, almost in the last few words… “For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.” (Rev. 22v18&19)
    In 1545 men’s laws and traditons were added to the Word of God. Please pray about this, that the Lord will reveal His truth to you.

  19. I totally agree with Mark 7, but we do not teach “the traditions of men”. What we call Tradition is nothing less than the oral teaching of the Apostles. Protestants actually do teach the traditions of the man Martin Luther who taught Sola Scriptura, & Sola Fide. These dogmas of Protestantism are non existent until 500 years ago with the advent of Martin Luther.

    St. Paul exhorted us to cling to the Traditions he taught BOTH written and ORAL. That is what the Catholic Church does.

    See this Post –> TRADITION.

  20. Hi Bfhu, I know just a little about Martin Luther. He was (like any other man, except for the man Jesus) not infallible. My faith and hope rests entirely in what Jesus has accomplished for me at Calvary. I believe that He died for me and I am trusting Him in my daily walk with Him. If I am walking with Him upon His return (or in the event of my death) then I believe that He will take me Home to Heaven. After all, when all is said and done, is this not where we all want to go?
    Which traditons does St. Paul exhort us to cling to – by the way?
    As a daughter of Abraham (by faith) my beliefs go back to the God of the Bible – much longer than 500 years ago. Roman Catholicism endeavoured to keep the “common” people in darkness with regard to God’s Word. Many brave people died for its survival. I don’t take this lightly and I thank God that today we may read His Word in our own language.
    I don’t know about “dogmas of Protestantism” – I only know my Bible which I date, every time I read it through.
    As for “recent” dogmas – the R.C. dogma of the assumption of the Virgin Mary, for example, was introduced as recently as 1950. There is certainly no mention of this in the Bible.

  21. Dear Ready,
    All I am trying to tell you is that you accept the idea, dogma, belief whatever you want to call it that if it is not in the Bible then it is not worthy of belief. But this idea is not contained anywhere in scripture. Yes it says scripture is good but it doesn’t say anything about rejecting anything and everything you cannot find explicitly in scripture. We all believe things that are not in scripture. The table of contents of the Bible is not dictated anywhere in scripture. That is a Tradition of the Catholic Church. The table of Contents of Protestant Bibles which are missing 7 OT books is a Tradition of Martin Luther. The Trinity is a Tradition of the Catholic Church defined at the Council of Nicea. It is not explicitly spelled out in Scripture. Yes this dogma makes a cohesive sense out of many otherwise incomprehensible verses but the Jehovahs Witnesses can back up their idea that Jesus was not God in the same sense as the Father and their rejection of the Trinity based on their reading of Scripture alone.

    When you see the scriptures that talk about the brothers and sisters of Jesus it is certainly understandable why Protestants interpret this literally and believe Jesus had siblings. But it is just as legitimate to interpret it with the Catholic Church that Mary had no other children based on the semitic use of “brother’ and “sister” to mean siblings and/or kinsman; exactly as we do today in English. You have to actually know the people in order to know whether the person means “my sibling” or not. Just as St. Paul addressed many of his letters to his brothers and sisters. We all KNOW they were not all his actual siblings.

    The dogma of the Assumption of Mary was NOT introduced in 1950. That is another Protestant myth. That is the date the belief was made dogmatic. It has always been believed. The Church only makes beliefs dogmatic when the faithful begin to get confuse about what is true because of inroads made by the surrounding culture. For instance, what if in the next ten years the Catholic Church makes it a Dogma that marriage is between one man and one woman. This obviously does not mean that this will be the date when the Catholic Church introduces the belief that marriage is between one man and one woman. But, rather because of the confusion permeating our western culture regarding homosexual marriage, many Catholics may be led to think it is OK. This is already the case. I would not at all be surprised if the Church makes a dogmatic statement in the near future.

    • Tell me then where is in scripture the immaculate conception??? Besides that the apostles of all people who knew Jesus, first hand wouldn’t they have talked about Mary at least to a certain degree which would make this argument valid!! I love Mary but Catholics are in denial!! I’m not Protestant or any other name but disciple for Christ!! I saved by Christ alone period!!!!

      Mary more riteouse than Abraham?? Are you God knowing someone is riteousnes? They both accomplished gods will. I love Mary I love Abraham I try to love my enemies but I will leave the grade of riteousness to god not the officials of the church! Noah if I was correct was the only human that god saved at the time of the flood because god found favor in his eyes!.. Words of Christ someone from the crowd shouts blessed is the womb to who bore you and breast who nursed you JesUs said RATHER blessed is those who hear the word of god and keep it..!!!

      • First you tell me where Scripture says everything we believe must be found in Scripture.

        Yes Mary was more righteous than Abraham or Noah or Moses. She was equal in righteousnesss to Adam and Eve before they fell into disobedience. Adam and Eve and Jesus and Mary were created/born without a sin nature. No one else was. Not even Abraham or Moses or Noah.

        Yes Mary was blessed to be chosen by God to bear His son but it all would have been for naught if she had “heard the word of God and Kept it.”

  22. Bfhu, Everything that I hold true, I believe, can be backed with scripture. The J.W’s have their own translation which leaves out all truths referring to the Trinity. The word “Trinity” is not found in the Bible, however, how clear is this?… “For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three agree in one. And there are three that bear witness in earth, the spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.” (1John 5v7&8) Jesus’ words in John 14v16-18 refer to the Father & the Holy Spirit, while in Acts 20v28 all three persons of the Trinity are beautifully portrayed.
    Unlike the Trinity, many dogmas introduced by the R.C. Church are not shown in scripture at all. You say above: “We do not teach the tradtions of men.” But anything which is not recorded in scripture is surely a tradition of man. As I have said previously – in 1545 Rome decreed that man’s traditon was to be equal in authority to the Bible. We are told not to add to God’s Word in Prov. 30v5&6 & in Rev. 22v18&19. But we do this if we add dogmas which are not clearly shown in scripture.
    As regards homosexuality etc., I will not embark on this subject just now – but certainly scripture makes it clear that this is wrongful behaviour for mankind. (Read Romans 1v26-28)
    You say that “many Catholics may be led to think it is o.k.” (On the subject of homosexual marriage) Will they only think it is NOT o.k. if the Pope makes a declaration against it? This is why everyone should read the Bible for themselves, while prayerfully seeking God’s direction on all matters in this life.

    • There is man tradition and apostolic tradition. The catholic church has apostolic tradition (christmas, easter) not man tradition (new years day,). God exercises his authority through his holy roman catholic church. Anyone who refuses to believe these dogmas is refusing to believe gods dogma. No. The catholic church doesnrt add to his word God speaks more words(outside of scripture) and the catholic church defines them as infallible.

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